When Jeff McKee stepped into our studio, he brought with him stories of transformation, endurance, and the deep connections forged in moments of joy and sorrow. We trace the origins of Trinity Bat Company which earned the stamp of Major League Baseball approval and is still his families business today.
The heart of our discussion beats with a profound respect for those who serve on the front lines as first responders. Jeff's calling as a fire department chaplain shines a light on the critical support our first responders require as they navigate through the aftermath of crisis. We share intimate glimpses of the sacred firehouse kitchen table, where laughter and tears are shared in equal measure, revealing the therapeutic bonds that sustain our firefighters through the toughest of times. Our narrative then pivots to the personal, delving into the raw grief of loss, the sanctuary of faith in the darkest hours, and the unifying power of community as we face life's most trying challenges.
As we wrap up our time together, we reflect on the enigmatic nature of life's trials and the resilience of the human spirit. The metaphor of the coffee bean's transformation through adversity serves as a poignant reminder that we, too, can emerge from our struggles with renewed strength. This episode is a testament to the unwavering hope that guides us through the ups and downs of life, and the indomitable connections that hold us together when the path ahead seems uncertain. Join us for this deeply human exploration, and let the power of these stories resonate within you.
Thanks for taking the time to listen in. Please leave us 5 stars on Spotify & Apple Podcasts with a review. THANK YOU!
When Jeff McKee stepped into our studio, he brought with him stories of transformation, endurance, and the deep connections forged in moments of joy and sorrow. We trace the origins of Trinity Bat Company which earned the stamp of Major League Baseball approval and is still his families business today.
The heart of our discussion beats with a profound respect for those who serve on the front lines as first responders. Jeff's calling as a fire department chaplain shines a light on the critical support our first responders require as they navigate through the aftermath of crisis. We share intimate glimpses of the sacred firehouse kitchen table, where laughter and tears are shared in equal measure, revealing the therapeutic bonds that sustain our firefighters through the toughest of times. Our narrative then pivots to the personal, delving into the raw grief of loss, the sanctuary of faith in the darkest hours, and the unifying power of community as we face life's most trying challenges.
As we wrap up our time together, we reflect on the enigmatic nature of life's trials and the resilience of the human spirit. The metaphor of the coffee bean's transformation through adversity serves as a poignant reminder that we, too, can emerge from our struggles with renewed strength. This episode is a testament to the unwavering hope that guides us through the ups and downs of life, and the indomitable connections that hold us together when the path ahead seems uncertain. Join us for this deeply human exploration, and let the power of these stories resonate within you.
Thanks for taking the time to listen in. Please leave us 5 stars on Spotify & Apple Podcasts with a review. THANK YOU!
Jeff McKee. Welcome to the podcast man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thanks for having me, Tim.
Speaker 1:This is sweet, absolutely, man. I've been waiting for this for a while. We've been talking quite a bit to get you on here, so this is going to be really cool. One thing I do want to say is you are the person that I went to for advice for doing the Night of Hope.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was so nervous dude, I think we went and got Mexican food right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, baja fish taco yeah.
Speaker 1:Santa Ana, let's go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the Lord speaks through fish tacos?
Speaker 1:Hey, he definitely does. Man I've always. I wanted to say on here, make it public like thank you so much for taking the time to do that, because I was so nervous I was, I want to do it. Then I didn't want to do it and the more I stepped away from it, the stronger pull I had on my heart to do it. So it was really cool that you mentored me, you gave me advice and you were pretty much just saying go for it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I just think, yeah, during that lunch, just hearing your heart, what the Lord is putting on your heart, Because there is hope. Right, there's hope. Yeah, and I think a lot of people they don't know that yet. Yeah, but then sitting there hearing and you've seen this wrestling match of I want to do this, but I have hesitations and it's just like man Tim God's put it on your heart you need to do it, yeah man it was.
Speaker 1:It was cool. It's cool to see how it kind of all came together and even when there was times where I felt like it wasn't going to work, the next day I get a phone call hey, this person's going to donate for this, and then you can use this church, this can happen here. And how it all came together. And just the night and me even speaking that was my first time ever speaking like that and just putting my heart out there, I was so nervous, excuse me. And then I went over it quite a few times, like I was taking things out and I remember thinking what verses am I going to use? What am I doing?
Speaker 1:I remember there was one time I panicked, dude, I was in my house like I was sitting on my couch looking at everything I kind of wrote and went over. I was like what am I doing? This is crazy, I don't do this. And I remember I still got a piece about it. And then, getting up there, I was so nervous. I'm like how am I going to speak? Because I do the podcast, I can talk to people, I enjoy it, but to be on stage, I started going. It was just like a peace and a calm came over and like, oh, we got this.
Speaker 2:I think this is going to be super good, it was a powerful night and I didn't know you can sing. So you're like you did the intro and then you stayed up on the stage and you're singing and I'm like man, god has blessed this guy with some skills.
Speaker 1:Oh man, I used, yeah, I sang, I wrote music for a while, did that, and then I went to the fire service. I was kind of like I need something stable and then I just stepped away from my faith and didn't, didn't want anything to do with anymore. And, um, yeah, I mean, there's so many people that have been always told me you need to sing again, you need to write like you got a voice. I'm like, yeah, we'll see. I don't know, but that was the first time I'd sang and gosh probably probably 10 years, eight years. I was actually doing it with a band and everything. And the funny part is we had none of us had ever played. Well, I had never played with them before, and that was the first time. And they're they're professional musicians. They actually, you know, they do that for a living and play at churches, and that was the first time we played together. It was wild dude. I'm like, well, they're pros, so they should have it down, yeah it was, it was good, Message was good.
Speaker 2:I mean testimony to, I mean especially Sharon, just about your brother, yeah, Um, just yeah Powerful.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was awesome, man and I just it's a huge, just a testament to you and how you're there for people and what you do, which we're going to get into. I just want to say thanks, man, it's been huge. I'm so glad that we have the friendship that we do and be able to talk with each other just about stuff that happens on duty for us as firefighters and then just outside of work and what we're doing, and it's something special. So I just want to say thanks. But, jeff, you told me something before we started that your family you used to make. You guys make bats, yeah, okay, so what's the story behind that? When did that all start? Yeah, I'm talking like bats for wooden bats for baseball, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, baseball bat 2005,. We had my dad and my brother, myself. We started a baseball bat company called Trinity Bat Company in Fullerton, southern California. Dude, trinity, I like that name. Yeah, I, dude Trinity, I like that name. Yeah, I like that name. Yeah, it's a good one. Well, here's the thing. So, wood-wise in manufacturing, my experience was wood shop at Tustin High School, oh, wow, yeah. So I didn't have a wood background, but we just had a passion for the game, yeah, and started.
Speaker 2:This small little bat company got approved by Major League Baseball in 2006. And that year Vladimir Guerrero, orlando Cabrera, a bunch of guys on the Angels started using them and word started spreading. What? Yeah? So you know, my job was the VP and I handled all the Major League sales, sales. But it was cool.
Speaker 2:In the bat company I really saw these pro athletes that were believers use sport as a platform to share Jesus with people. That's rad, super rad. It planted this ministry bug in my heart that I couldn't shake. I tried to shake it. So when you were talking about going to that lunch and you were wrestling with man, I want to do this, but there's, I have hesitation. Yeah, so I, I knew exactly, I know what you were feeling, um, I just I felt that a couple of times when I felt God was moving, he's calling me into something Um, but yeah, in that bat company I something Um, but yeah, in that bat company I. Opportunity to, to see sport and a platform to bring hope into someone's life, into a sport like into a clubhouse. It was really cool.
Speaker 1:That is cool how so how did you guys get approved? Is it being I'm saying the right verbiage here approved for major league? Yeah, how does that work. They want to see like it's a legit. You know, like, is it like measurements? It's, how does that work. They want to see like it's legit. You know, like, is it like measurements, it's, how does that work. Yeah, so you.
Speaker 2:The hardest part about it is getting a liability insurance policy in case the bat breaks and flies in the stands. So you have the way the wording that liability insurance policy has to be worded. Wait a minute.
Speaker 1:So okay, so they buy your bat and they're, they're up to bat. They hit a ball, the bat breaks and goes into stands. The MLB is not liable.
Speaker 2:You are, as the manufacturer the bats and uh, but yeah, over over this, like in the last 15 years or so, there's been more research into what wood products are being used. Okay, actually strength testing, um, you know so that there's a, there's an ink dot test on the handle and the way the ink bleeds on that you can read the grain of slope. So if it's like three degrees off, you don't send that out, because if it's more than three degrees it's more likely to fail. So, multi-piece failures, wow, fail that three degrees. But if it, when you put that ink dot test on there and that ink bleeds straight, then that's, it's a good bat. You can send that out.
Speaker 1:I had no idea that much goes into making bats. Yeah, that's that's. It's a good bat. You can send that out. I had no idea that much goes into making bats. Yeah, that's, that's incredible actually. Yeah, well, so I'm, you don't have to say a number, but I'm sure that policy has to be pretty big. Oh, it's a big ball.
Speaker 2:That's the hardest part. Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah, that's the hardest part. You, there's a, there's a fee that you pay and there's an annual thing you pay and I know that's gone up over the years and um, and then the uh, the first part when you first get approved, you have to have a letter from a major league club saying that you know these players from the club they want, they want your product. So then the angels, the angels were able to get us that letter.
Speaker 1:Okay, um, how well then. How did you first get your? How'd you get them to use your bat to get that approval?
Speaker 2:yeah, so we uh, it was kind of one of the things vladimir guerrero at the time he was like the biggest, he was one of the biggest names in baseball. Um, I did research online, I made him two bats and I just kind of guessed of what model, length and weight and everything made him two bats and sent it to him for spring training. So then they'll, they'll get up, try it or whatever. Um, so we show up to spring training and you know, guys are like sending vladi like six bats 12 bats.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, so there's other people vying for that right?
Speaker 2:yeah, okay, okay so you know, and here we send them two, you know. So I'm just like, oh man, we got no shot. Yeah, well, you never know this, you try like you do no, but yeah, so he ended up using. He ended up using like one of our bats the whole spring training. Took the other bat on the plane with him opening day in seattle. He loved him and yeah, it was one of those things where it just it started. It kind of started the ball rolling.
Speaker 2:More guys in you know, major leagues started using them Started. Well, hey, I want to try it out. Like here's my model. This is what I use. Can you make one for me? Okay, so we would make them samples and they would try it out. And it was, the product was always good. I feel like what separated us was the turnaround time, especially for the West Coast team. So I would go to San Diego or LA or Anaheim. I would see a lot of teams that would come in. East Coast teams would come in. They would stop in San Diego. I would get a sample from them. They would go to L.
Speaker 1:I would meet them in LA with that sample bat, Um, but yeah, it was really cool, Really fun to be a part of it. That is so cool. I had no idea that you, that's that's what you did for a while. Yeah, Well, now, when they so they use your bat you got the letter you're approved for major league do you make them? You know you make a batch for a team or is it specifically for each player?
Speaker 2:it's for the player, okay. So usually on the on the big league side, uh, equipment manager will order a dozen for spring training, okay, and then a dozen for opening day, a dozen at the all-star break, okay, and then, depending on if they are like playoffs, then another dozen, okay, for each player, for each player. Oh, they don't break that many, but they're just to have stock. Uh, you go on a road road trip. You know they're going to take, you know, four to six bats on a road trip for that player. Wow. So you know, if you got a guy on the mound throwing 100 miles an hour inside pitch, you know you're breaking a bat. You know you, you, they're. That equipment manager has backup bats for all those guys, geez yeah, that's it.
Speaker 1:So what? What is the wood that you use for the bats?
Speaker 2:so ash birch and maple maple's the hardest, uh, but it's the least forgiving. Maple maple's the hardest, uh, but it's the least forgiving. So, like, if you're watching a ball game and a bat breaks, and usually, like, the barrel flies out more than likely, that's maple. Okay, okay, but it's really a hard wood, uh, the ball really, you know, jumps off of it dude, that is so interesting, yeah and you guys are still doing that now, right, yeah, my dad and brother, they're still doing it, still manufacturing.
Speaker 2:And Corey Seeger. Corey Seeger is one of their guys and he's tearing it up with Texas Rangers. It's been cool. There's a couple Trinity bats in the Hall of Fame. It's really neat. That's so cool. Ben Zobris from the 2016 World Series One of his bats is in there.
Speaker 1:That is so cool, so in one of his bats is in there and that is so cool. So in the hall of fame it's like it's in one of the glass cases, oh yeah, and has your, has a plaque for your name too is it just.
Speaker 2:No, it's just, it's one of our bats and ben, you know, ben signed it, or whatever player signed it, and yeah dude.
Speaker 1:That's, that's huge, it's sweet. That is pretty right. You mean, that's a legacy for your family. It's fun. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Now are is the rest of your family, since the name is Trinity? Are they believers as well? Yeah, okay, okay. Are they pastors, like you are?
Speaker 2:at any chance, no no, plugged into the church, serving at the local church, and yeah, we it was in a print shop is where we kind of dreamed of this and we'd say, hey, if this is going to work like God needs to be, all in this. There's seven stars in the logo. So in the book of Revelation God said he holds seven stars in his right hand. Let's go. That's where we needed to be and we wanted to be as a business, as a company. So yeah, it was cool. And still they're manufacturing bats for teams in Korea, oh wow. Yeah, a lot of overseas. So you're international. Oh, yeah, a lot of overseas contracts. I love it. Yeah, survived COVID. I think that was the hard part for them was getting through that, because all sports were shut down.
Speaker 1:Oh, it took a huge hit. Yeah, so would you consider that company? Is that a small business? Would you say it's a medium size?
Speaker 2:yeah, medium size business. And yeah, and is it just wood bats?
Speaker 1:Just wood bats.
Speaker 2:Yeah man, my God dude, you're see you're interesting high school sports, right Baseball, are you? Is it being like a chaplain or a coach? I do both. Yeah, I'm at Orange Lutheran High School right now. I coach there a couple of days a week and then also they're chaplain. So we do baseball chapel in the team room and that's cool, yeah.
Speaker 1:That's super rad. And how did you so? You're a chaplain for fire department. How did you get into that? Because I don't even know. I know the process of trying to get hired, right. You take a test and backgrounds and all this, get all your certifications, fire academies but what does that look like for chaplains? Is that different for each department? Or I mean, how does it work?
Speaker 2:Yeah Well. So I graduated high school in 95. I went to Santa Ana College. I wanted to be a firefighter and I started taking the core classes. I'm red, green, colorblind and that was going to stop me from graduating from the academy at the time. And I was just like I got this big old, huge no from the Lord. This is an avenue I'm not going to take you down. Um, I was crushed by it.
Speaker 1:yeah, I would say that had to be kind of hard right, because that was probably a dream at the time.
Speaker 2:It was a dream yeah, yeah, big playing in the big leagues and then, or being a firefighter that those are two like dreams of mine. And, um, so, fast forward. You know I go into the print shop, you know I make baseball bats. I get ordained as a licensed minister through our ministry, through FCA, the sports ministry that I do now, and also through the local church, and a buddy of mine calls me out like four years ago, and says, hey, this fire agency, fire agency is hiring for chaplains. Um, I know your story, I know your testimony. Um, like, I think you need to apply for this. So I'm like, okay, I'll think about it. He says no, he says it ends in three hours, like, job posting is down in three hours. So I just like, okay, I'll just fill this out. I didn't even submit my resume. I just like this isn't going to work. Yeah, but okay, if God wants me to do this, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I ended up getting a call and an interview and then it's like, then it hits. I'm like sitting there all nervous, but I'm like, why am I so nervous? This is like a volunteer position, gotcha, you know, okay, um, but yeah, then they said, they said yes, they brought me on as an associate, um. So then we kind of get our associates, get our feet wet and, um, get in and start learning the language and I felt like God allowed me to be a part of it early on, to understand the language, to understand the culture. So, just enough, like I felt like god brought me in, yeah, to understand a little bit of it.
Speaker 1:It's like he was still prepping you, even though, no, for one part of the fire service it was a yes and another it was a yes and the other. That's huge, man, yeah, that's huge. Wow. Now, how long you've been a chaplain now. So three years, three years, yeah, man, now as a chaplain, I'm sure. Actually, I know I had a call that was very rough and it, you know, involved a child and I remember I believe it was you. You showed up with the counseling team we had and all that stuff, and we had that talk around the table and that was huge. That was really huge, cause I didn't realize how much that call actually bothered me until we had gotten back and I remember it was in the morning I just did the checkout my rig and we got that call and it was crazy, right, it was so much went on, it was very sad.
Speaker 1:We get back from the call and I usually go for a run in the morning, cause there's a field over there by that station I used to work at, or a soccer field, soccer and baseball, and that's where I'd run laps. I'd run laps and just do three, three miles and I get out there running and I'm running and that call was across street from that field and every time I pass I could still see the police there and it was just. And I kept thinking about the call and halfway through that run I just broke down. I was like, man, this is, this is messed up, like I'm not doing good. I went back to the station. I was like, hey, man, we need to call them out. I think we all need to have a talk Cause, you know, initially everyone says, oh, we're fine, we're fine, we're fine. And then you show up in the counseling team and we start you know, how do you guys feel this and that? And they kind of I was like I'll speak up first. Yeah, this is not cool, this is messed up. And then you can see everyone start to open up and talk and I think that's that's one of the things I've realized in being this career for as long as I have it's like 17 years, is.
Speaker 1:You know, we see a lot of bad things and I don't think the normal, the public, civilians, understand what we see on a day-to-day basis when we go to work, you know, and I see that with my own family. They're kind of like oh, you know, you got a cool uniform, shiny red edge, and it's like it's a lot more than that. But the importance of having our chaplains and counseling team, international, or just anybody that's there on call to support us and help us during those times times because it's not normal to see death and violence as much as we see it, and that's why I want to ask you, is like in your position. I mean, you have to see that there's such a huge need for help, for hope.
Speaker 1:Right, that's the biggest thing I talk about. I almost said preach, whatever. I ain't no preacher dog, but it's the biggest thing. I always say, because I see it so much with my fellow co-workers and firefighters um, you can see, there's it's, it's not just the things at work that we see, but we take it home and how do we process that and get it, you know.
Speaker 2:So it's one of those things like for you, I'm sure you, you see, need oh yeah, I think can't like, can it be okay that someone's not okay and it's like even for us. So I feel like even just God's put on my heart. And who's responding to the first responders?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And as a chaplain, that's part of my role. So I'm not a pastor Like I don't come in and preach, right, so it's it's how do I walk alongside, how do I come in and support, how do I encourage? And in, in moments like those where a debrief is called, um, you know a lot of times what we've seen the captain's senses or feels that someone is off a little bit. A debrief is called Usually when the conversations are going down, everybody is engaging in it, and then you kind of see some of the, even just some of the emotions arise and I even feel like I feel with certain. You know debriefs I've been a part of. It's like years of emotions. I feel a hundred percent. It's not just that's this, it's not just that.
Speaker 2:One incident that happened five, six hours ago, yeah, um, it was, it's years of emotion and um, you know we've had people say like years of emotion.
Speaker 2:And you know we've had people say like, hey, I've called this for someone else, but I needed it as well.
Speaker 2:And our job as a chaplain is to walk alongside, right, we're not going to push faith, we're not going to push Jesus on people and for those who have faith to come alongside of them pray for, for them, like when those debriefs are going on and the chaplains you know them and we're just praying our whole way through it because one we want people to to know hey, there is hope, what you're feeling like is okay, yeah. And then even the process of talking about it, like if it can be normal and okay to talk about things in the next, like the first 48 hours of what you guys experience, like that box in our brain becomes really, really small. But if we don't talk about it and we just say, hey, we're okay, and internally we could be just broken up over it. Now that box is huge, yeah, yeah. And then the next call could be, or a call 10 years down the road is what could trigger something yeah, man, it's.
Speaker 1:Uh, it's such an interesting thing because I know I struggle with that for a bit of not talking and having the experience that I have and being on as long as I have. It's truly. I mean, there's a documentary about it, right, the Call we Carry.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And it's so true. It's like I bury these things, right, you bury it, but eventually it stacks up and it's going to come out somewhere. Whether it's in your personal life, whether it's at work, you're alone, whatever it's going to be personal life, whether it's at work, you're alone, whatever it's going to be. Because we see all these things and then we come home, we're expected to be a father, a husband, brother, uncle, whatever it's going to be a normal person in society. But you just you see some crazy stuff. It's like, man, this is wild, this is crazy. It's like, how do I process it? I got to a point where thinking like I can't, I'm helping others, but I can't even help myself yeah, it was, it was such a, it was very helpless feeling and then realizing, okay, I'm going to call somebody, I'm going to use what we have the counseling team, international column, and and get that, which I think is great.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:At least we're you know where we work. It's free for us which is huge.
Speaker 1:I think it's so big. It's a big deal to me because I've already convinced and talked to a few fellow firefighters I think it's about 10, 10 or 12, and I've gotten them to do it. All of them have said I should have gone earlier. It's needed. You have to talk it out, you have to get them the emotions that we have from seeing and dealing with things that we deal with. That's, I mean, that's God given man, that's in you so you can process. It's okay to cry. It's okay to get angry Now don't get angry where you're punching somebody but yeah, it's okay to have some of that anger, that doubt, that let down the sorrow. I mean you want to get that out because it's your way of processing. You know and realizing, know it. It helped me be able to process things so much better, Cause you know, I remember just coming home being quiet all the time you know, and it's a hey, are you mad?
Speaker 1:No, I'm not, I'm not mad, but you keep asking me I'm going to get mad. But it's like God, how do I? This is crazy. You know, I remember a shift in my old department. I was a young medic early on and it was probably one of the craziest shifts I've ever worked.
Speaker 1:We, we started the day and I was one of the busiest rigs that we had there. We, we had a stroke person and then we had someone had a heart attack, couldn't save them. Then we had this TC cut and rescue. The person was mangled and deceased. Then we delivered a baby. Then we had this TC cut and rescue, the person was mangled and deceased. Then we delivered a baby. Then we had a fire. Then we come back. We had another pregnancy where the baby was almost delivered and then, boom, it was seven o'clock, time to go home.
Speaker 1:I remember just driving home in silence like that was intense, man, it was crazy. And then it's like how do I process that? How do I get to that? And realizing that we have the resources to, to be able to, to talk that out and talk to somebody, and it stays there. It doesn't. It doesn't mean you're crazy that you talk to them. It's big because it used to be taboo. I would say the first 10 years of my career. You don't talk about it. Yeah, be a man. Yeah, it's like eh, there's, we got an issue here, right? And the sad part is suicide. Is that number one killer now?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And it's sad and I've seen it and you know, because I talk about my faith on here a lot more now, and how much it's had an impact on my life. It's really cool to see how many other first responders are now messaging me and talking to me and starting to say hey man, I'm struggling with this. Yeah start and say, hey, man, I'm struggling with this. Yeah, I'm having a hard time with this and that's why I'm like hey, call this number yeah you know, let's, let's, let's meet and get coffee and talk yeah you know.
Speaker 1:So what you do, it has more of an impact than you think, man. Oh, it really does so, but it's got to take a toll on you. I'd imagine yeah, no, I have people I talk to too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it, you know, I'll, I'll call, I'll call my wife and um, so I have a team of people as I'm responding to a call. I have a team of people that I text, so they're praying for me and they're praying for who I'm going into, uh to, to help and um, uh, so then when I leave, um, I've got a good buddy that I call. Okay, we usually go to lunch and it usually is Baja Fish Tacos.
Speaker 1:Baja Fish Tacos baby.
Speaker 2:I'm not contracted by them, at least not yet, but we're there a lot Bringing them plenty of business. Yeah, but we'll all go and meet and then I'll debrief myself. You know, because we see so much, but it doesn't make sense. And even why, like why? Why does this happen? And you know, like, and even just I think the what a lot of people wrestle with is you know, why does God allow this to happen? I wrestle with that. Yeah, absolutely. There's, there's calls that you guys see that it's just like, man, this does not make sense and um, but that's where, like someone who's following Jesus, it's just like, okay, god, I, man, I'm having a hard time with this, but I'm going to continue to trust you.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm going to trust you. But you said something I feel strength in the fire service is you go back to your team, your crew Usually it's four people, three or four that table, the table that you sit at or you have a meal at, you share, like your coffee at. I feel like that's the opportunity to where it's like the informal debrief, yeah, and if that could be a strength within the fire service of an opportunity to where maybe one or two people you know and hey man, what'd you, what'd you think of that call?
Speaker 2:yeah you know, or, and not even like, not even a task oriented debrief, but you're not, you know, you're not, you're not trying to. Hey, man, you could have done this better, or you know, right, so, but it's just, how are you doing, um, you know, and and even, just, man, that that kind of rocked me a little bit. Yeah, you know, I think, for us as chaplains too, the things that we see, you guys have seven, eight calls in a row in the middle of the night, yeah, and then you're not able to sleep, you know. And then that last call, I mean my last debrief, there were seven calls for this crew. It was all during the night and there was a TC on the 22 freeway with fire. The person was able to be rescued, but they were all burnt up and it wasn't good.
Speaker 2:Um, you know, but it's like they were, they're going all, they were going hard all night long, yeah, um, you know, and then that was their second day, but some, some guys, were also on their third day, you know. So it's just like you know, it takes a toll, takes a toll on you. So I say all that though, man, if we can find time, maybe not necessarily within those calls. But before you go home from that shift, just uh, if, if everybody's okay and we don't want to go in and have a formal debrief, but you know can, can somebody? Before you get in the car, you know, hey, let's just talk about this real quick. Yeah, you know, can, can we, can we process this real quick, you know cause? Then I I do believe then when you go home, then that husband or that wife, like now, that your relationship with your spouse will be a little bit better, yeah, the relationship with your kids will be a little bit better.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's, it's be a little bit better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's funny. You say that the firehouse kitchen table, I think, is such a sacred place. You know it's a special place too, I think, because you know, not only can we sit there and talk things out and debrief from calls and help each other, but, man, some some of the best laughs I've ever had. I've been just sitting around having coffee, talking to my crew and then even learning to fix my first couple of homes I had. You're trying to, hey, how do I put floors down? Oh, hey, this is how you do it.
Speaker 1:You go here, do this or that, or call this person, call that person, and celebrating someone's birthday or holidays there. It's such a great gathering place to commune together and have that crew cohesion, that unity. It's not just talking about fire service stuff, but we talk about life together and you know there's been a few guys at that kitchen table. We've shared tears where it's not just stuff at work, where they're having trouble at home, they're having difficult times. You know, and you, you sit there with them and you, um, you walk with them through that. Yeah, and they and it's so cool Cause it's unique, you don't get that in many other jobs. You know, you just clock and go to work and go home.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But there's, you know, there's such a connection that you have at that, the firehouse table that's so unique and so special to me, and we start our day with a coffee break.
Speaker 1:Let's be real, right, we get to put our stuff on the rig and then go to the kitchen table, have coffee hey, do your turnover. How was your shift? Hey, oh, the day's off, how would that go? And you talk with the guys, the gals at the firehouse, and you have your conference call and do your thing and then we cook. We do so much right there at that kitchen table and playing cards and laughing and having fun, and it's something I wish everyone could experience. They're not really going to be able to have that. Let's be real. Most people, yeah, but man, that kitchen table is so unique and so awesome. It's something that I don't ever want to take for granted. Yeah, I love it so much. Man, there's some funny dudes in the fire service.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, Some characters there's some funny dudes in the fire service, oh yeah, characters. Oh yeah, man, you get all walks of life in there. So it's yeah, you have a huge point on that, man that that firehouse kitchen table is something that could be utilized very well, yeah, very, very well. But something you said that's. You know, I, I do struggle with that, you know, coming back to my faith, but then also seeing that, what, all that we see in the fire service and then what I've experienced in my life, you're kind of like question things a little bit and I tell people to me I'm like it's okay to question things, me now making my relationship with the Lord a relationship personal, not religion or rules and laws.
Speaker 1:It's so different now. My prayers are different. It's not this. I mean, I'm sure there's time and place. You know, bow your head, close your eyes, do all that. To me now it's like it's almost like when I was reading the book of Job. You know his prayers were rough. Yeah, man, he let the Lord have it, but he always finished with I trust you and I love you. Yeah, you know, and that's kind of where I'm at now, where, from having a bad day or seeing stuff, it's like, dude, what's going on? How could this happen? Like, ah, this hurts me. I'm upset, like, why would you let this happen? But I'm going to trust you in this. And it almost comes back to my own story, even with when my brother was killed in a car accident, seeing the pain that my family went through, especially my parents. No parent should have to bury their child.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That is just the. You know. I've never seen my parents in so much pain, and to see my dad and my mom just crumpled over on the couch, crying but also praying, that stood out to me. Were they perfect people? No, none of us are right. They had their own issues, but they tried their best to put the Lord first and make sure he was first in our lives and to see where they were then and then to see where they are now. It is so. It's a miracle and there's nothing that could do that for them but God putting their faith in Jesus. And that's something. Now, when I look back now as an adult and seeing all that I've been through that some things I didn't have control over and some things I did and I totally messed up and made horrible decisions but seeing how the Lord has carried me through those times to where I'm at now, you look back. You're like, oh, I get it.
Speaker 1:It doesn't make sense, but I get it, you know it's it's really interesting and even when we had the night of hope to, I was really nervous because my family was there. Right, I love my family, right, we, we're always there for each other, no matter what you know. And they know my dirt, that we are like they know I'll just I throw it up to my mom and my sister. But, gosh, it's so cool how they're so accepting and they never judge, and for them to see the path that I had been on to where I'm at now and then I'm putting on this. You know this event and I'm speaking.
Speaker 1:I remember they're kind of like, are you serious? Like you're going to go up there? I'm like, yeah, I'm just going to bring it. Like you're gonna go up there. I'm like, yeah, I'm just gonna bring it. But then to see them there worshiping and singing and then hearing me tell not just my story but our family story and what we've been through, and say, yeah, it was a rough road, it hurt, it was painful and we still mourn his death at times, but we rejoice differently because there's hope. We know we're gonna see him again. I mean, I said it when I was up there. The reality is, none of us are leaving this are going to stay on this earth. Yeah, like we're all going to die.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know it's, it's just a matter of when and how, right. But knowing that death isn't the final answer. And we just celebrated Easter, which is so beautiful, and it meant so much more to me this year and I'm Gosh, I'm trying to get emotional but it means so much to me more this year because I've just seen how far he's brought me and what he's done. It's because of what he did on the cross, it's because he had to die. He was that innocent man who knew no sin, became sin, died for us, and then he rose to give us hope, to say, hey, I've made a way out for you, it's over, it's good. All you got to do is accept me. It's so powerful and it's so simple, but yet people think it's not.
Speaker 1:It's like oh, what did I tell you? It's so much more simpler than you think and all I have to say it's having that faith now and that trust has brought so much more peace. That knowing. Okay, I know you know I hope I have a lot more time left on this earth, but I know there's going to be more tough times coming. There's going to be trials and tribulations, you know, and. But I know that what I, whatever I go through, I'm going to be okay. It's going to hurt. He knows that pain, he's been on this earth and he lived it. But he's going to make it make sense one day. And that, to me, is such a comforting piece and, for me, more of a definition of love.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That true love. I'm going to be with you. I'm going to walk with you through deep waters, yeah. When you're on the mountaintop, I'm going to dance with you too, and when you cry, I'm going to cry with you, I'm going to catch those tears. And so, trying to make sense of things, sometimes it's hard and I question it, but then I fall back on that faith. Like you know what? I'm just going to leave it in your hands, dude, it's going to be okay.
Speaker 1:That's when you hit on that point it's like man, like why, why do these things happen? What do we do? Like, how do I handle this? You know, but I can say it from my life as a testament. Like he works it out, yeah, I don't, I don't know how this, as they say, right, the Lord works in mysterious ways. Yeah, but he does. And it's sometimes I can't explain that to people. I'm like you have to experience it. I mean, I have been at a point where it's like I thought my life was over, like, yeah, this is it. Like this sucks, you know, and it's just I don't know. I'm sure you see it with what you do, yeah, and what you do for us and even in, you know being teaching or coaching baseball and all those things and molding those lives. I mean, gosh, I would imagine you see people struggle with that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I think I mean the last couple of years too. There's a couple of families within our program and you know the dads are battling cancer. You know, and it's like, you know, here's a high school kid and you know their hero, their dad, you know, is struggling with this and you know I've had a couple of them come up to me and, just like Coach, I know God's with me but I'm just not seeing him right now, you know, like trying to.
Speaker 2:I could see this, you know, 16 year old, trying to hold on to hope, trying to hold on to something, and it's like man, okay, hey, he's there. You may not see him, but he's there and let me walk with you. So, and then you know that was last year, that conversation happened, and then this year with the same athlete. It's like, coach, I'm reading the book of John and I'm in God's word and you know, I'm just, I'm plowing through, like I want to follow Jesus and I want to be as close as him as I can. Yeah, you know, and you know the dad's still struggling with cancer, you know, and still fighting it. And you know it's like, but, man, I see, I see this youngster, this young man, you know, like following Jesus, you know, and like following Jesus is hard.
Speaker 2:You know, I'm 48 years old and following Jesus is hard, like it's like a white knuckle ride and it's just like, but that's where it's. Just like God, I'm just but. So that 16-year-old boy in me hearing that athlete say I am not seeing God in this? You know, I've had multiple times in my life. You know, my wife and myself we didn't have kids soft for four years. We had two miscarriages and one of them was really really late and it just totally it rocked us. Um and um. It was just like god, I'm gonna trust you in this, but like I'm having a hard time understanding. You're having a hard time understanding, yeah, but I'm gonna trust you. Yeah, um, you know and, but I'm going to trust you. Yeah, you know, and God has blessed us with two girls now. I mean, they're 18 and 20. You know.
Speaker 2:But so then I get a phone call from a fire captain two years ago and well, he wants me to come to the firehouse, come have coffee. And he would strategically call me hey, can you come and have coffee around the table. He wouldn't tell me why and he wouldn't tell me for who I was coming for, uh, but I would hang there and then somebody would follow me to the car. Um, and you know this one individual, he was struggling, his wife had a miscarriage. Um and uh, it was just like. So I'm like internally, like I'm nodding my head and he's like I don't know if you know, uh, how I'm feeling. You know, I said, I do know how you're feeling.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I know, I know how, like I know how it is to try to process my own feelings and then also support my bride Right. How do I support her and her feelings and deal with my own feelings and then also support my bride right? Yeah, how do I support her and her feelings and deal with my own feelings?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I like I know, I know how you're feeling and so to say it's you know, and I still get emotional Like when I, when I talk about that, that you know those years, but um, and I God has done some work through that to where man, I know how it feels. You know, as a man, as a husband, you know, when I feel like something happens to our wives like that, you know, we, almost, because we want to help, we're fixers. Oh, 100%, like, how do we fix this? Yeah, well, god's not saying yeah, he's not asking us to fix it.
Speaker 1:Let's go.
Speaker 2:I like that's not asking us to fix it. Let's go. I like that. He's asking us to trust him. Yeah, he's asking us to trust him. And even you know we've had conversations with our girls. You know what, what? What I be here If, if you had to miscarriage, if you didn't have a miscarriage, would I be here?
Speaker 2:And it's like I have no idea. But you're here, yeah, right, like this was a part of god's plan for our lives. Um, you know, I'm, I'm here, you're here. Um, so I just think man, it's and we try to make sense of it. Um, but sometimes I feel like we can see, you know, you get 20, 30 years down the road. Okay, god, I can kind of see why you allow that to happen. You know, like me getting the note for the fire service, you know. But then, 30 years later, you know God's allowed me to be a chaplain for people in the fire service. You know he brought it full circle. You know, if he'd have told me 30 years ago that this was the plan, I would have messed it all up, right, yeah, yeah, you know I would have messed it up. But you know, there's times where and I think I shared this with you when we went to lunch.
Speaker 2:God doesn't waste things. Let's go, baby, where we feel that man. I went through two years of Santa Ana College to pursue the fire industry and I wrestled with that of man for a long time of two years. Okay, god, what do you? How are you going to redeem these two years? Yeah, you know, and I've come to realize that he doesn't waste things. You know, even our trials that we go through, even our questioning, you know, do you think of a diamond? The amount of pressure that's on that coal, right, and then it becomes a diamond. What we do at the table at the, at the firehouse, we drink coffee. What we do at the table at the, at the firehouse, we drink coffee.
Speaker 2:In order to drink that, that that bean has to be like, picked right, so pulled off of off of tree, roasted in fire, you know, and then ground up Right, right, right, and then pour hot water over it and then you get to taste it and it's tastes so amazing, right, but what that bean goes through. You get to taste it and it tastes so amazing, right, but what that being goes through to get to that. So I'm like man. My life is like that coffee bean. Yeah, right, there's times in my life where I don't understand it. But you know, when you're brewing that coffee and you smell it across the room, and you know, like that's my life, that you know, as we follow Jesus. Those are things in our lives. It may not make sense, but, man, god, I'm going to trust you, I'm going to, I'm going to follow, I'm going to trust you.
Speaker 1:Well, look what, look at, look at what is done in that. You know those miscarriages and that, that, that firefighter that followed you out to the car. I mean, how correct are you saying he doesn't waste things, right? Yeah, that was a difficult time. I get it. I've actually been through that. It's hard, that is a difficult process to go through, and especially for the female. But I just know as a guy.
Speaker 1:It really was hard to not be able to do anything. It was just kind of like, well, I'm here, gosh, and you want to be able to take that pain and help them get through that. And it's so frustrating, it's so hard, and the hopes and dreams you had for that pregnancy and that child, it just feels like it's just shattered. But now it's like you're helping somebody else and to me those things like that that plays into eternity. That's priceless man. I mean, my goodness, you're literally counseling somebody who's going through a difficult time that's going to hopefully start relying on the Lord and change their life and help them get through a trial. I mean, goodness, what more can you ask from somebody to live like the Lord did and just minister to people and help them? I mean, because the reality is everyone's going through something. That's one thing I really realized.
Speaker 1:I'm like, wow, I, I was seeing how they uh, a firefighter, uh from a local department reached out to me yesterday and, uh, we've been friends. We were friends a long time ago. I honestly forgot about this guy and not mean. But time passes and people move on and things we hadn't talked in probably 15 years and, um, he hit me up out of nowhere, sent me a text message and he said, hey, this is such and such. I'm like, oh, my gosh, you know, hey, how's it going this and that? And you know that's probably a loaded question right, yeah, how are you? Yeah, you haven't talked in 15 years. And boom, long text right, I'm going through this and this is what's happening. And, um, you know, going through a divorce, we've just had our first child. This is happening at work. I'm stressed out. But I'm just like, wow, and this person, honestly, I never would have thought this is someone that kind of like the top tier always does.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, life looks like they're doing great and you're just like Whoa dude and I remember I just immediately called him and we just chatted for a little bit. I'm like, hey man, there's nothing I'm going to be able to say to you that's going to really bring peace to you right now. Besides, just mind, if I pray for you, that's the best thing I can do for you, but I've been there. I know it's like going through a divorce. That's terrible, it's a hard, hard thing, but it hard thing but it's not the end.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know it's like. I promise you it's not the end. If I can make it through that and the other things I've been through, you're going to be fine. But is it going to be a hard time? Absolutely. It's going to be very difficult, but you have somebody that loves you more than anyone in this world will and he knows what you're going through. He knows that pain. You just got to tell him man, talk to him, and then hearing him break down the phone and praying, and you know he texted me this morning. He's like man. I'm so glad I called you. He's like I was listening to your podcast and you said you came back to faith. He's like you're the first person I want to talk to. I'm like man, I appreciate that, but I'm like I'm nobody. But you know, finding my faith again and be able to minister. You know, talk to people and not force anything on them. I'm not about that. I'm not about, like you know, turn or burn, you know. But it's like you said, just be there.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Let them talk, walk with them through it. You know, have that empathy and realize, my goodness, dude, people are hurting.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you want to tell them. I have the answer. Yeah, I got it for you, but the hard. It's that thing where it's so hard because you don't see it. But you got to have faith but he's yet. He's all around us. You know and you want to. It's like sometimes I still struggle with that, but it's like if you just let it go.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Let it go, let him work, let him do what he's going to do. It's going to be okay, you know, and it's cool to hear him say, like I finally felt a little bit of peace. He said he slept good last night, finally, and trying to figure it all out, you know. So it's really cool to know, and it's me agreeing with what you said he doesn't waste anything. And like, when I think back on my life and what I've been through, it's so true how many people I've been able to just sit there with them, as someone calls it the pit. You know, be in the pit with them, like I don't say a word usually, I just sit there. Yeah, I tell them we don't have to talk about any of it. If you just want to hang out, like, let's go to the beach, let's go surf, let's grab coffee, let's and they usually just start talking and you just let it out.
Speaker 1:You know, and you know, to me that's special, yeah, I think, to have some people that you can talk to and trust yeah that's the biggest thing, is that trust. You know you're not going to just spread it out to everybody. You can trust them with that pain yeah um, a special. You know, to me that's very special and it's very hard to find that nowadays with people. So to to know people can trust you, yeah, it's very special and it's very hard to find that nowadays with people.
Speaker 2:So, to to know people can trust you. Yeah, it's huge, right? Oh, yeah, it's, it's big. Oh, we, we, we protect our underbelly, right? Yeah, yeah, we do it's. Uh, you know, we protect it.
Speaker 2:And I think, in, you know, when I first became a chaplain, you know like I I show up to my stations I had a big old bag of coffee I love hidden house and um, the cool spot in san anna, but um, the guy with the owner was a military guy and believer, yeah, like you know, just try to. I want to encourage guys at my stations and you know, and kind of meet them, you know, and um, so I would drop off coffee for them and um, just really try to connect. And it was the start. It was the entry phase, kind of of that of building trust. Yeah, um, because I felt like even for a while, um, you know, guys weren't calling, like yeah, it was quiet, um, but then I knew like, okay, my guys in in my area they were still going on some of these hard calls and uh, but the more I would show up and uh, just even to get to know. You know some of the BCs and stuff and you know, it was just.
Speaker 2:It was just, I don't know time. And being consistent, show up. You know which I can see is a ministry of presence. You know?
Speaker 2:like, if you like, if you want, you want to be used by God and show up. You know like there's there's been times to where I've had opportunities to show up and you know God's just like okay, here you go. You know, like you know that I've I've had an opportunity to show up. Um, we had like, okay, here you go. You know, like you know, I've had an opportunity to show up. We had a fire captain pass away of cancer. More recently, I had an opportunity to go to the hospital with one of our other chaplains and be with the family this last Christmas. The chaplains we just got like numbered badges based off of the number of chaplains that have been within our department. Very cool, my badge number is 27. Okay, 27 was the last station that this captain was stationed at. Oh, wow, when I showed up at the hospital, the captain's mom was there. I didn't know, you know, I didn't know his family or his mom. So as soon as I walk up, I ended up seeing this lady that you know had a hat on and I just gave her a hug and it was his captain's mom and she looks in. She was like you know, five, six. I'm like, I'm like six, three. You're very tall man and, uh, her like eye level was right at my badge. Yeah, so she looks at it, she's 27. Was that the station you're at? And I said no, ma'am. I said that you know, that's my the chaplain. I'm a chaplain and and she says my son was at station 27. And she says I love number 27.
Speaker 2:Now some backstory about my badge number. They asked me what my favorite Bible verse was and they wanted to put the Bible verse on the back of our badges for all the chaplains. That's cool, which was awesome. My favorite Bible verse is Psalm 27 one. And the whole time, like I was and I didn't know I was a 27th chaplain in the history of our department yeah, um, so, uh, this mom is struggling the loss of her son and she's quite, she's asking, it's like she's wanting hope, like you know, and she's locked in on number 27. And she's asking she's wanting hope and she's locked in on number 27,. And she said that 27 is her favorite number. And I said 27 is my favorite number as well. And I said my favorite Bible verse is Psalm 27, 1. And she looks up at me and she says what is it?
Speaker 1:Beautiful.
Speaker 2:And I just said the Lord is my light and my salvation. Whom shall I fear? The Lord is a stronghold of my life. Whom shall I be afraid? And the whole time she asked can you stay with me? Wow, you know so it was a special moment. I mean, they had, you know, a code honor in the hospital. I had an opportunity to walk with this family during this time and it was just as a mom like this mom was. Just I've been so locked in on number 27. And you know, here God even flipped it around, gave me an opportunity to share a scripture verse with her. It brought her hope. And then she asked if I would stay with her the rest of that time. And that's beautiful. Yeah, there's a ministry of presence. Yeah, like, if I'm not, if I'm not showing up, then I don't. I don't have that, I don't have that story and how God uses number 27, that. And then I had no control over that number, and then I had no control over that number, no control over that number, gosh man.
Speaker 1:Isn't hope such a powerful thing, powerful? I mean. Sometimes I wonder, how do people make it without having faith in Jesus? That's what I want to know, because I've been there and to me it's a dark place. Yeah, I mean, my goodness, I, you can, you'll cling to certain things. It'll just take you deeper and farther down a dark hole.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know, and I just wonder, oh, my gosh, that's why I was so, so big on hope, telling people hey, look, there's hope, there's hope to get you out of these issues and these problems that get you through the pain. I mean just to be there with that family. I'm sure that, gosh, that just probably meant the world to that mom, because who, again? No parent should have to bury their child?
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:That is. It's a terrible thing, but just to be there in that presence with them, I mean that's so powerful and priceless.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know, that's my goodness, that that's my goodness, that's what the Lord tells us to do, right? Yeah, it's wild man, I know, but it's really interesting too, the kind of the times we're living in. I've wanted to kind of ask you about this, but gosh, it's the state of our country, not just our country, but the state of the world. I mean, you hear preachers talking about a lot about revelations and I mean I do think the Lord's coming back, do I? Is it tomorrow? No man knows, lord doesn't say that, but gosh, it does seem like things are lining up. I don't know. I've always wanted to kind of ask you about that, what your thoughts are on that, if you have anything to say about it, because it's again, it's, uh know, wild times man.
Speaker 2:I mean to me, we make sodom and gomorrah, we put in shame. Yeah, that's my thought. Yeah, no, well, scripture says you're not going to know the time right, the day or time of when he returns, right? Um, so how do you respond to that? The response is to be ready, yeah, right. And like is your bags packed? Are you, are you ready? Do you know where you're going? Are you saved? So I think that's the first thing is because you know even the smartest Bible scholar. You know they, they don't know Right, and only God knows. But yes, when you, you turn on the TV, it seems hopeless. Right, 100%. It is scary and he has to be returning soon, but we're not going to know the time right.
Speaker 2:We're not going to know the day and the time? Yeah, so I think, man, for me it's just a major call to action. I agree with you. It's how like. Is there one more? Is there? Is there, you know, hacksaw Ridge, right?
Speaker 1:Is there one more? Just give me one more.
Speaker 2:And I think, um, you know, it's just man, I don't know it. It might be, it might be one more person that says yes, that says I believe, to worry when he returns. But so I, you know, my dad grew up in a Christian home and my dad was like you know, this was, you know, 50 years ago. He's man, jesus, has to be returning soon. Yeah, you know, and that's how I grew up with it too.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I think, even now, you know, but it is true, each day, the next day, we see it's like it's even closer, yeah, um, but I personally I'm not getting locked in on trying to find out when it is same same. I just want I'm, I feel like I'm ready, my family ready, but there's more people, there's still work to do. There's still work to do. There's more people who don't know Jesus yet.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And it's like man. That's the mission God's calling me to. My mission field is athletics right now. All I needed to to my mission field is athletics. Right now. It might you know, I get opportunity to walk along as a chaplain within athletics, within the fire service. Now I'm also a chaplain for the police department in Santa Ana PD. Oh dude, that's huge. Yeah, so it just came down in January and so now it's just like man to to walk alongside of first responders and you know, so it's been this like man. Not how could I walk alongside of people who are seeing things that seem hopeless, right? So how could I help bring hope into the room?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's. You know I took all the news apps off my phone. Most of them. There's like one I keep, but it's just because every time I put up my God, people are terrible. You just look at it's like good Lord, what is going on in this world? But you, you bring up a really good point of there's still. You know there's still work to do. You know I I pay attention. You know I read those things and I kind of grew up in a Pentecostal home and you know revelations in times was a big deal.
Speaker 1:It's like okay, I get it. He's coming back, like cool. But I seem to pay attention to it a little more just because of what's happening around the world. And even, like, what was the other day that they made yesterday transgender like something I can't remember what it was. I'm like really, like of all days you're gonna do it, like on easter, like, come on, like, and I'd say this I don't look, you people can make, make your own decision. I'm not one to judge because I I have plenty of faults. You can love what you love, do what you want to do, but I'm just saying like you will be accountable to it one day, everybody will you know, but all days we gotta do it on that day yeah and there's one thing that's been coming up on all these uh feeds, the, the um, was it the eclipse?
Speaker 1:that eclipse, that's gone, gosh. People are pulling on that so hard with conspiracy theories and other things. I'm like, look man, what's gonna happen is gonna happen. Just be ready. That's why I always say just be ready.
Speaker 1:But I've noticed the more I talk about my faith to people and it becoming a little more bolder with it, the more I'm noticing more people are starting to kind of come back to their faith as well. They're like yeah, you know, I actually started doing this and reading this a little more and my family's gone back to church and I say, oh well, why look at, look what's happening in our country, look what's happening in our state, what's happening around the world that people are kind of nervous like, well, yeah, it's pretty wild. It's almost like bad is good, good is bad. You, you know, there was a. There was a. I think there was a preacher, I think it was on the east coast, I don't know, know if you've heard about this, but I guess he went to an abortion clinic and prayed and he put him in jail. Wow, yeah, I'm like huh, interesting. Now would I go to abortion clinic and pray through the halls? Probably not, but I was still. You know pray for these people, but that seems wild to me.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I don't think, like, what did the guy do wrong? Yeah, you know he's just praying for people, but it's it's really to me I've. It seems like more people are starting to come back and there's more of a you know, a bit of a revival kind of happening on. That's just my opinion from people messaging me, messaging me and talking to me. I mean people that when you, I've known them for a while and I've never had that kind of talk with them or told them what the Lord's done for me or how I've changed my life. I just kind of live my life the way that.
Speaker 1:I do you know? And then they say hey, man, by the way, I just became a believer. You're like what you Like what it's like. Oh no, you're cool. I get it because my family thought I was a mess and they didn't think it was serious at first. But it's cool, I'm actually. It's exciting to me the times that we're in. Yeah, there's madness going on, but there's also a lot of kind of awakening happening. They're realizing, hey, like we need Jesus in this world. Man, it's crazy.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:There's a lot going on and they're worried about their kids yeah, their family what their kids are being taught in school, what's being forced on them, Like again, like I don't care what you do, but why do we got to force them, Like, how much do I got to play along with this, yeah, you know. So it really does seem like there's kind of an awakening happening, a little bit of a revival, and it's cool to somewhat be a part of it. You know it becomes a annual event. I really want that to to turn into something and get more people to come and have other, you know, Christian bands or speakers, whatever it's going to be, Cause it was so hard to find someone to speak and I thought it was going to connect with people and that's why I was like I'm just going to do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm just going to go for. It is what it is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I well, I believe that you're just scratching the surface. For that, the first responders night of hope Um, I, I, I, just, I really feel that first responders, they need hope. Yeah, whether you're so you're, whether you're following Jesus or not, whether you're a person of faith or not, yeah, um, you need hope and I believe hope is a person and his name is Jesus. I just, I don't know. Even so, the first night, right walking in, I just felt there's something different here and I felt like people were coming into the room with burdens because life is hard, and walking in and it's like man, I'm not alone. I'm not alone. I'm not alone in what I am carrying, I'm not alone with what I'm struggling with, that there's other people, that we're all in this together. We're going to encourage each other, we're going to get through it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know I think you mentioned earlier Easter right, the cross, the grave, the empty tomb. The tomb is still empty. Yeah, so I can still, today, run and see the tomb is empty. Jesus is alive, he's alive and the promise is that he's with us.
Speaker 2:So when we don't know what's going on, when we feel like we're going through this, or whether it's cancer or divorce, or you know, I had a cousin, who you know, who took her own life.
Speaker 2:You know, like 35 years ago, she was a believer, she was schizophrenic, manic-depressant. Before all this, she went to Christian school, went to Bible college, you know, and this was even before like just the mental health knowledge that we have now, um, but she took her own life, she felt, she felt like that that was what God was calling her to do, um, and there's, but there's still hope, like I've sitting with my family in Arizona, um, arizona, of just mourning of what happened and in the midst of that there's still hope. But, man, can we get to somebody before that happens, right, right, can we get to somebody before that happens? Can we get to first responders before that happens? Can we be the catalyst that lowers that percentage? Because I truly believe. I believe if more people respond, if more people show up ministry of presence, and someone knows that they are not alone, yeah, right, yeah, they're not alone. And because that alone, that alone peace is what leads people into a bad spot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That's how I felt for a while.
Speaker 1:Yeah Alone.
Speaker 2:But really, if you were to take a step back, you weren't alone. You had people around you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know around you. Yeah, I secluded myself. I did it. It was a conscious decision. You know what it was.
Speaker 1:It was the guilt and the shame. It's like, oh, I don't want to Look what I've done. I can't be around my family. They're believers, Realizing they still have their issues, but they're too perfect. It's embarrassing and just cutting everybody off. And that's when I take a dark dive and it was such a bad place to be in and you're right, it's just being there with somebody, the presence. And I recently have a family member that's going through a hard time and I was like, no, now is not the time to be alone. Now is the time to spill your guts to us. Don't feel the shame, Don't feel the embarrassment. Like all of us here have our own issues and skeletons and things that we've done. You're not going to shock us Like we love you. Tell us what's going on. Tell if it's something you did that was wrong. It's okay. We're not going to judge you Like we've all had some bad, bad decisions. But that's the thing I love about my family is we come together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we put everything else aside and we don't. We don't say what you need to say, because we're going to figure it out. You know we're going to be there and that hope is so hope. I thought about this the other day. I was at work, and it was the night before Easter, I was working Saturday and it was, you know, good Friday just happened. And I thought about this Jeff, um, jesus died on that Friday.
Speaker 1:Boy, what did? What were the disciples and the like? What were people feeling on Saturday? How hopeless, you think, they felt. Yeah, even though, like, jesus told them, I'm going to be raised again on the third day, right, but they just saw someone get tortured and murdered, I mean unbearably, on a cross, which probably had to be traumatic in itself. And then, okay, that's it, it's over. Saturday comes, I wondered. I'm like, boy, I wonder how they felt, how that must have been to experience that. And even when the women went to the grave and running back, oh, he's not alive, no, he's here, yeah, he's here. And then, boom, he appears and it's like, yeah, touch these wounds. Yeah, I'm alive. But I always thought about, boy, I wonder what that was like on that Saturday. Yeah, how dark it must have felt for them, I know.
Speaker 2:Bob Goff. I love Bob Goff's quotes and I follow him on Twitter, but he has a quote something along the lines of it's all on Good Friday, like Jesus's followers, scattered, you know. Darkness fell, it was chaotic, but then heaven just started counting to three.
Speaker 1:Ah, let's go.
Speaker 2:So it brings hope to me. Right, god was still in control of that. Yeah, because in the garden before Jesus asked man if there's any other way like God father, like can there's any other way like God Father? Like can there be any other way? You know, but he knew there was no other way.
Speaker 2:You know, it was a part of their plan from the very beginning. It was a part of a rescue plan for me, for you, like for everybody. But so the Roman soldiers, they thought they were doing something good, yeah, right, yeah, um. But then, heaven, on friday man, heaven just started counting to three, because three days later he rose from the tomb and then he started appearing himself to everybody and that he was alive. You know, and on sunday morning I always think about he's a Mary and Martha, right, they're the first two to run to the tomb, yeah, you know. And then word got, and then the disciples ran to the tomb to see for themselves, you know, and I'm not a fast runner man, but I picture myself right, I would be.
Speaker 2:that would be the fastest I'd run. Oh the adrenaline.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, was it. Who was it, isn't it? Peter said like it was Peter, yeah, I ran, I made it there first. Yeah, he is, is that?
Speaker 2:is the athlete. Yeah, he had to put that in.
Speaker 1:I do, I think I'm faster. Yeah, what's so unique too, you know, is when he did when they look in the grave, you know he folded his, the garments that he was in. Yeah, I always find that so unique. I'm just like I wonder why he folded it. I wonder what that's about, you know, it's really interesting.
Speaker 2:Well, here's the thing, and I don't know, this is just my two cents from a Santa and a kid my two cents is that if someone took them, they're not going to fold. They're not going to fold his clothes.
Speaker 1:That's a good point.
Speaker 2:It's a very good point, but if it was part of a plan, right yeah. And if the stone was moved from the inside out which it was, it wasn't moved from someone from the outside to come in, it was from the inside out, and so in here it was Jesus, right? So he's going to leave. He's going to leave it right there.
Speaker 1:It's so beautiful. Yeah, Dude, it's gosh. I'm trying to get choked up because it's so. He did it for us, man yeah it's such a. It's a. It's a brutal story yeah it's very harsh, that type of death that people don't know, like if you really do the research. I remember reading into it man, I mean you can't. He was unrecognizable yeah at some point he was beaten and tortured so much, and then to rise from the dead and bring that joy, that hope, the salvation. You're redeemed, it's over the veil's torn.
Speaker 1:You can come to me now. And I remember telling somebody and I've heard this so many times that stone in front of his tomb wasn't rolled away for him to get out. That was for them to look in and see like, hey, it's complete, it's done, it's amazing, it's so miraculous man. And my favorite line it's in the book of Luke, when Mary and Martha were there and they saw the angel, right One. If I saw an angel, bro, I'm so glad.
Speaker 1:They always say to do not be afraid, because I'm a scary person. I get, I get jump scared real or quick, right, you see something that magnificent, yeah, I'm gonna run. So the fact that they even just stayed there and started talking right is amazing. But he said why are you looking for the living among the dead? He's not here, he is alive. Yeah, oh, dude. When he says, why are you looking for the living among the dead? Like that line, it gives me goosebumps. Yeah, it's amazing, it's powerful. Yeah, it's redemption. Yeah, it's a like dude, he, he finished it, he did it for us. Like he made a way out, we're gonna be okay. Yeah, it's out, dude, like I'm just gonna get this now dog, because there's a song by phil wickham.
Speaker 1:It's called sunday is coming, oh yeah, and I love listening to that because he builds up in that song and he has that line in there why are you looking for living among the dead? He's alive. He's alive, hallelujah, he is alive. And when I play that, I blast it. I blast it because it's a promise that was fulfilled and all his promises are true. It's such an amazing day and it's the greatest day in history. Yeah, greatest comeback of all time is what I always say oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, big time. Yeah, I love worship music. It's my go-to. Worship music's my go-to. I definitely feel like that man when I'm having a day that Phil Wickham's on the list the new Matthew West Don't Stop Praying. He's good, that's another good one. I Speak Jesus. There's some really good Christian music that's out. I find hope in that, 100%. Yeah, it's God's word that's being sung. But yeah, I just think of man when I'm questioning things. I'm struggling with something. That's my God's word prayer and then worship music. But yeah, coming out of easter, those who are following jesus, we get to live our lives like every day, as if it's easter sunday morning. Oh, I love it. That is so true. Is that that's? That's the game, like that's what we're doing, that's, I mean, that's we're following him every day. It's like easter Sunday morning.
Speaker 1:Gosh. You know, I've noticed, just from playing music and writing music, a lot of times where words fail, for me music takes over. It doesn't even have to have lyrics, I can just listen to music and you know when something's good, it doesn't matter what style, what country, where it's coming from. When you feel it, you're in it, dude, you're like, oh yeah, this is good, you're jamming, You're doing your thing, and it's one of those things for me, like worship music, just the hope that it has in it. It's reminders. It's a reminder like we're going to be okay, you're good. And it's also for me during the tough times or questioning or I'm down.
Speaker 1:It tough times, or questioning or I'm down it's a way of me to remind myself to give him praise and acknowledge like I'm hurting and this is hard, but I'm going to sing, I'm going to keep going. I'm still going to be in your presence. Right now I don't know what's going on. This is not cool, but I'm going to be in it, we're going to go for it. So I agree with you Do it a hundred percent, a hundred percent. But, jeff, we, we gotta wrap this up. Man, thank you so much for coming on. Are you, are you guys? Are you gonna be involved with your family's company making bats still, or no, you kinda all the way out.
Speaker 2:I'm all the way out. I still go and support them. I still stop by. Okay, hang with my dad and brother over there. And yeah, still, I still look for the bats on TV Like I can't watch the game the same. Yeah, yeah, but I definitely am rooting for guys that are using the bats. You know Gavin Lux, you know with the Dodgers, that's super cool. Yeah, corey Seager with the Rangers. Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 1:I'm happy for your family. I think that's unique and so cool, man. Keep going, dude. And what you're doing with being a chaplain and supporting us, um, you know it's priceless man. I can tell you just just from the time you came to the station when we needed you, when I needed you, and then just meeting up with me and being a mentor, it's meant the world. Um, you know it's. You may not see a reward now, but I'm telling you it'll be probably tenfold in the next life. So please, keep doing what you're doing, man. Be there for us. I love you, dude. Honestly, you're becoming such a good friend. I'm thankful for you to come on this podcast. I actually hope you come back on, which would be really cool. Bring another chap and we'll chat it up and talk. But, jeff, thank you so much, man for being here, coming on mentoring me and just being who you are, man. It's very inspiring, it really is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love you, tim. Keep up the good work, man. Yeah, you just got to the service of the first responders night of hope. And yeah, how, how I can partner with you and encourage you. And yeah, keep up the good work. And yeah, keep responding. Keep responding to people's bad days. And and know that there's a team of people that are praying for you, walk alongside of you.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that man. You're the man, bro. I got a challenge coming for you too. But hey, we end every podcast with a let's go on three. Are you ready? Yeah, let's do it. One, two, three, let's go. Bye everybody. Thank you so much for listening in. If you liked what you just listened to, please leave us a five star review on apple podcast and on spotify. Please follow us on youtube, on instagram and on facebook, and a big shout out to stephen clark, our sound editor. He's a huge part of this team that is unseen. It's eight, nine barbers our first sponsor. Feel good, be great. That's two locations Orange, california and Long Beach, california. Book your appointment online 89barberscom. Bye everybody.